M3 race car future: IP or JP, Opinions please.

[JClark]

Looking for outsider opinions on this. Hear me out before you decide. Read carefully, I try to make it as clear as possible but apparently it isnt.

My car is headed towards BMWCCA Club Racing next year in I-Prepared or J-Prepared. I'll explain the difference in a minute. Prepared class is a more developed race car but still keeps the spirit of the original car (as in no semi-tube frame chassis, custom suspension geometry, etc). For what we're talking about here, the motor, no major internal changes are allowed except for valvetrain work (cams, most notably). Manifolds are free, etc.

Reasons for going prepared are:
1) Car is already prepared legal and competitive with the exception of a full cage, [more] interior stripping, and more motor.
2) Modified is the next class up and is stupid expensive to make competitive. We're talking $10,000 cages and $6,000+ motors rebuilt every off-season. Stand alone ecu, widebodies, and ridiculous suspension geometry where the spherical bearings alone cost more than my data acquisition stuff. Like the raw bearing, not even a custom made part yet. Steve J could tell you numbers, you'll poop yourself.
3) There are more prepared cars out there in general than mod, meaning more competition, which is what this whole IP vs JP thing is about.

Ok, here's the breakdown:

--IP is generally for prepared level E36 M3s. To get the most out of the class, you need the 3.2 liter motor (S52) out of the 96-99 M3s, mine is the 3.0. The 3.2L would net me around 265-275whp. IP is usually the second biggest (number of competitors) prepared class at any BMWCCA club racing event.

--JP is generally for prepared level 3 series cars. I can enter as JP if I put in a 3 series motor, either 2.5L or 2.8L @ around 225-235whp or so.


Also of note, to swap any of these motors into another E36 BMW is strictly mechanical. The motor drops in and you plug the original harness/sensors back in. NO electrical work. Simple.

The ONLY difference between the two classes would be the motor. At any time I could drop in a 2.8L and be JP or drop in a 3.2L and be IP.

Why the hell would I want less power (and go JP)?
1) JP is the BIGGEST PREPARED CLASS in the country (number of competitors). Meaning anytime the green flag drops, I have tons of competition which is the reason to go racing.
2) The motors are STUPID cheap. 3 series motors are $300-700 and M3 motors are $2500-4500. Those are stock, no mods included. I could run the balls off of it and pop them all day. I'd have at least one spare motor in the truck at all times.

Those are the main reasons. Competition and money, but IP is no slouch for competition either; it's still the second biggest class.

The horsepower difference is small and is frankly the last part of the car I care about.

Opinions welcome.

Car will be a full blooded race car, not a fancy pants pretty street car that can run 9s all day with yo girl in the back. Yo girl can still get in the back, but she's going to be sitting on a lot of sick ass cage work.

[badtang]

i'm all about running cheap, w/ plenty of pare parts...i say go e30 m3 4cyl...nothin says badass like factory widebody fenders, and 4cyl full of torque...

[mikecentola]

After discussion and clarification on aim...

I voted JP. Having the extra money to race and have spares would definitely be a benefit where you can keep racing if something were to happen along the way. I misread at first thinking it would be worse to have more people in the class, but it seems competition could be a great thing.

Sounds like a great thing.

[JClark]

Originally Posted by badtang

i'm all about running cheap, w/ plenty of pare parts...i say go e30 m3 4cyl...nothin says badass like factory widebody fenders, and 4cyl full of torque...

Ya kinda missed the boat completely here. I'm not getting a new car, just swapping motors.

[badtang]

gotcha...got caught up in the moment...anything you can have a spare for is always a plus, as i can get parts for a 350chevy/351w in a grocery store...i like not being the only bmw freak on here...

[JClark]

You are not alone.

Pole is going completely opposite of what I was expecting...

[badtang]

i'm tearin into my snapped timing belt bent valve mess in a day or two, hopefully the forged nitrous pistons held there own, bitchslapping the valves into place...so i only have to rebuild a head, not from the block up...

[JustAFocus]

i vote jp, more competition only makes you better, and more money and cheaper to stay on the track only makes it a better reason to go jp

[BoxerSix]

Clark, as much as I would love to rebuild the S52 hear, you know what I'm going to say. There's no point in owning a race car that you can't afford to race. I'm not saying you can't afford IP but the sugar coating of the cost effectiveness of JP makes it worthwhile for the grassroots type like you an I who don't have a host of sponsors paying for the biannual engine rebuilds or the occasional wadding.

Hands down JP.

I can build a motor either way. It's rather unfortunate of the situation with the S52 here, but maybe it's a good thing. Line hone about $300 after I mill .002" off each main cap and full crank machine work about $175. I haven't even begun to mic anything, but cylinder #6 has a fine vertical scratch in it that needs to be and can be honed out but how much I don't know. Toss in block hone work, new rod and rod balancing, parts, labor....this "cheap" S52 just got real expensive for the condition of this particular block. Personally, I think it's time to start recouping some of that money on this motor via part selling

[JClark]

I'm not made of money in the least. I can barely afford to go racing in IP, so the extra cash would be helpful, especially if EACH RACE TRIP is $1500-2500 all inclusive depending on distance and if I run a brand new set of tires each time (a must to get those last few tenths out of a lap).

I agree on the S52 you have now. I found 2-3 S52 blocks that I might be able to nab and we can start over. Do you know if the crank is shot yet? Those f*ckers are more expensive than a bare block.

BTW everyone, this motor decision directly reflects Boxersix and the shop full of BMW motor parts he has in the garage since he'll be building the motor with my amateur assistance when possible.

[Cavi Mike]

Instead of giving you my opinion, tell me what you want out of this. If I yearned to be top-dog, of course I would go IP but if I just wanted to race I would go JP. What is it that you want? Do you want to shoot for top-dog or do you just love the fact of being out there with a bunch of other guys that are doing the same thing you're doing and loving every second of it?

I guess the real question is this:

A: Is this your hobby? Is this what you do because you can have so much fun and can enjoy it with tons of other people?

OR

B: Is this what you eat, sleep and breathe? Are you constantly trying to be ahead of the guy in front of you(literally AND metaphorically speaking) and do you find yourself as a solo artist, not part of a group?

[JClark]

Option B, but picking a class because there are less people in it and thinking it'll be an easier win is a shitty way to "win".

If that was the case, I'd turbocharge a 7 series and run in AMod. I'd run stupid long lap times, but I'd be the only AMod car there and obviously win. Shitty.

The odds of me winning either class nationally are extremely low. The big dogs do this full time with an unlimited budget. That means making every race nationwide for points and testing every day in between.